Man Sues For Right To Worship In Prison »
Posted by: Radiofreeeuropa 8 months agoUTAH STATE PRISON ââ;¬" An inmate is accusing the Utah Department of Corrections of denying him his right to practice religion while behind bars. "Plaintiff complains that his being denied the right to practice his choice of religion while housed at the Utah State Prison is violating his First Amendment rights,
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Radiofreeeuropa8 months ago
This is no different then a christian or muslim asking for religious items. Seems prison administrations, a branch of the government openly promote only one religion over another.
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Locky128 months ago
Sorry, Radio. Your argument doesn't follow.
If Christians need anything at all, it's from a book which they can get at the library. Same with the Jewish. Muslims just need a rug.
This is the only guy that needs a laundry list of items and he's in prison. The Judge needs to tell him- tough $hit, you're in prison. Go worship a real God until you're released.
If he was such a good Norseman, he wouldn't be in prison in the first place.
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rdy2rck8 months ago
A prison can not accomadate everyone. Besides, to me faith beliefs come from the heart not the courts.
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Radiofreeeuropa8 months ago
This guy wants a cardboard sword, shouldn't be too difficult to deal with. It just seems to me if you accommodate one you have to accommodate them all. Either that or allow none. People seem to think accommodating their own belief is OK but don't seem to want to give others the same respect they demand for their particular rituals. It's all equally ludicrous to me. I don't see one as better than another.
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jordan118 months ago
Well what if he was a Mormon practicing in secret . Would they let it fly then ? I never read about Satanists practicing in jail . They need special stuff also , including blood sacrafices . Now , how would that work ?>>>>>
You're deflecting. He isn't asking for the 'stuff' you describe. If you're going to go there, then that rationale can be applied to ANY religion. If Catholic prisoners want cardboard crosses, then we must tell them NO!....because "what if." You can pull that "what if" game with virtually any subject.
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BoxMonkey8 months ago
Yes jordan11 , I agree with you . However , the Inmate is asking for stuff to practice his religion . And even cardboard can be rolled up tight enough and be pointy enough to inflict bodily damage . If they had a special area , such as a locked room for his religious practices , that wouldn't be too bad . After all , they have a chapel . Unless the chapel can be a multi-use area for all religions . I wonder if the guy ever listened to REM's "Losing my Religion "?
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CaptainLucid8 months ago
My dad is diabetic to he has to prick his finger and put the blood in the tester. Maybe this will work for the satanists. Prick your finger and put a drop on the alter.
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Spadecaller8 months ago
"If I had a hammer
I'd hammer in the morning
I'd hammer in the evening
All over this jail
I'd hammer out danger
I'd hammer out a warning
I'd hammer out love between my brothers and my brothers
All over this jail..."
You should have heard me singing this...(not really)
Give the poor shmuck his thor hammer.
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Neophile8 months ago
It's not an actual hammer. It often takes the form of a pendant or medallion in the Asatru religion. You know... kind of like a crucifix.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mjolnir
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gamahuche8 months ago
Freedom of religion rules in the US, I know.
In every other country that I know of his "religion" would not be recognised as such.
That being said he also blew his chance at the beginning by checking the wrong box.
If, g_d forbid, I were ever to find myself in a US prison I would demand that they honour my shamanistic tradition which requires both large quantities of mind-altering substances and also human goddesses on a daily basis to fulfil other ceremonial functions.
All to be provided at taxpayers' expense, naturally.
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jordan118 months ago
So what if he ticked the 'atheist' box. By your analogy, those who get 'reborn' in jail shouldn't be given religious instruction at taxpayer expense...or a bible, or whatever else they ask for. There is such a belief system, & he obviously knows something about its symbolism. He didn't pull it out of a hat.
http://altreligion.about.com/library/glossary/s...
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gamahuche8 months ago
I'm not sure where he pulled it from..
I think I'd rather not know.
I tried to make it clear that I was approaching it sceptically and I defend my right to be sceptical at least as strongly and probably more consistently than he defends his new-found religion..
Recognising someone's rights to religious beliefs does not mean that you have to throw your critical faculties out with the garbage.
If a cat has kittens in the oven it don't make 'em biscuits.
P.S. Nice art work in the link. Not much about religion though.
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ciera-marie7 months, 4 weeks ago
jetstan19 and the rest who have commented so far:
Because of my job, not only do I get to go to several Stand Downs (for homeless Vets) throughout the year, I also have to go to Transition Fairs at six different prisons throughout the state of MN.
Not only are Christians allowed to worship, so are other faiths. At Pine City they have meditation space available, a waiting list for Sabbath services (minimum of 12), and have a sweat lodge.
If Prison Fellowship is allowed in and given Federal money to minister to prisoners, then ALL FAITHS should be allowed period.
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jordan118 months ago
he claims are necessary to practice the Asatru religion, which worships ancient Nordic gods like Odin, Thor, Tyr and Heimdal.>>>>
Asatru is easy enough to look up for its symbolism. he claims are necessary to practice the Asatru religion, which worships ancient Nordic gods like Odin, Thor, Tyr and Heimdal.>>>>
I just looked it up, and Asatru does indeed have a lot of symbolism. Not my place to make a judgment of the man's choice of belief. Not anyone else's either.
It said he ticked the box that said none/atheist when he entered the prison. So I guess what they're saying is, he's lying about the religion he claims. Interesting when you consider that it's accepted when prisoners claim they find god in prison...the Christian god, that is.
They're going to lose this case, as they should. And shame on them. I guess they forgot where they live.
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Charlson8 months ago
After reading about the Asatru religion, I learned that some of the neo-nazis groups have embraced and corrupted the religion with their racist, anti-Semitic, and homophobic beliefs and incorporated Asatru symbolism in their ceremonies. But as long as the practice of his religion harms no one and is not disruptive or infringes on the right of others then by all means allow the man his religious symbols.
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Candida8 months ago
Yes, but not necessarily in his cell unless others have their religious symbols in their cells too.
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Radiofreeeuropa8 months ago
Nazis adapted the symbolism....Well they liked Wagner too, doesn't mean that Wagner liked Hitler....
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johnnyt8 months ago
i am a christian i find it a travesty that he is not aloud to practice his chosen religion. if he chose the none/atheist box when he went to jail is beside the point. not knowing about his religion i am curious if it is possible to provide a time during each day where he would be provided with these items to perform his ceremonies then they be stored securely to prevent the possible use as a weapon by him or others. he should be provided with the opportunity to experience the religion as it was intended.
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Rinaldi1008 months ago
A religion is a religion, as long as it does nobody else any harm (unlikely with any religion) let him practice it, just make sure he does not impose his BS as an absolute truth on anyone else, as some other religions do.
As long as he keeps to himself.
Thor, Mohammed, Christ, Budda, Jehova, etc..
Give me a break!
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crghss8 months ago
This is such a reach by the religion haters on nutscape. They gave him an answer to most of the thing he wanted. Then when the inmate makes a shiv out of the items he wants and kills someone you'll be screaming "Bush is trying to have inmates kill each other so corporate government makes money"
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ciera-marie7 months, 4 weeks ago
crghss:
Pine City is a level four Maximum Security Prison in MN. This supports one of my earlier comments.
Their is a Sweat Lodge for the Native American prisoners to use. Including the instruments needed for the Sweat Lodge. Being Maximum Four prison there are guards watching and all items when not in use are locked away.
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MacR8 months ago
This debate about whether he should have the items or not. Or that he checked the none/athiest box is quite funny.
I bet there was not a box for him to check. Let's face it, the goverment limits what you can check off. You might see a box for Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Budhaist and possible other. Yet, I bet it is just these four. With none/athiest being the 5th box.
You will not see a box for Taoism, nor will you see a box for Satanism. Nor will you see a box for being a Druid/Shaman or Native American Indian/Shaman.
You can not have freedom from religion or freedom of religion if you limit what you can check off. Just like freedom of speach. You need to let everyone talk, not just the ones you do not want to hear from. Sad that there are some of not thinking that way.
Just because you are in jail, does not mean you can limit religion. Our Founding Fathers were not cruel. Even they understood this.
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AtheismIsRealityComment removed: User banned.
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Locky128 months ago
It should be said that anybody who is not a Christian is in utter denial of historical fact.
Let the negative vote avalanche begin.
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AtheismIsRealityComment removed: User banned.10 Replies
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Harbeas8 months ago
I get upset when I see the courts having to take time to rule on these cases from prison. Once you are sent to prison it means you cannot be a part of civilized society(that's why your there). A law abiding citizen enjoys certain rights which you have now given up. The only rights you have now is to be fed, housed, needed medical treatment and get plenty of exercise(pounding rocks all day). Once released you can enjoy those rights again!
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MacR8 months ago
The thing is that the one right that the prison system can not keep you from is your faith. That does not fall into the your rights are gone when you are in prison.
I know people feel that we have every right to take the rights away. From someone who is in prison. The thing is though that even religion is a right that you have while in prison. You see, you are a felon, you lose your right to vote. You lose your right to carry a firearm legally. But no one in this country can take your right to freedom of religion or freedom from religion.
No where in the penial code does it say that you do not have the right to practice your religion while incarcerated.
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vettenut8 months ago
jaern:
Your comment reminds me of the fact that the New Uniter, that Wonderful Harbinger of True Political Change (Barack Hussein Obama) voted AGAINST legislation that would have required inmates to bear the cost of their multitudinous number of superfluous lawsuits......
And I would post a "LOL!!!" right here if it weren't so sad but true.....
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abntv8 months ago
So does all this mean they should give people all the wine they want to practice their religion? Should catholics demand a sword? where do you draw the line. Do you really need all this stuff to practice your religion?
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vettenut8 months ago
As a Christian, I say that everyone should be free to believe any religious stuff they choose.
The question was asked by abntv: "where do you draw the line?"
Here's something I propose:
I believe that this "freedom of religious practice" for inmates should involve the possession and use of "holy writ" from one's chosen religion.
I do not believe, however, that said freedom of religious practice should automatically extend to physical items ("props") that one may choose to deem "necessary" for religious practice.
What does it say about a religious system wherein it is not possible to "practice" that religion without a long laundry list of props, including, among other things, mind-altering beverages and lethal weapons???
My faith requires NO PROPS, BEVERAGES or LETHAL WEAPONS. I invite those who are captive by requirements of the above to consider changing their religion!
There really IS freedom from all that STUFF!!!
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tkyrchncs8 months ago
I think you'll find that everyone in prison must be allowed to have or have access to non-hazardous materials for worship. But these things need not be provided, Bibles included, at public expense. So if some of his co-religionists wish to supply the things he needs, and they meet the prison safety and security standards, I can't imagine any court refusing this.
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ETproductions8 months ago
Personally, I am a Crackacretist. In order to properly worship my god, Crackcrete, I need an operating jackhammer. So if I am ever imprisoned, I implore my friends here on Propeller to take up a collection and UPS me the necessary artifacts for my required religious ceremony. Do not anger Crackcrete!
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