The Separation of Church and State »
Posted by: jovial 8 months, 3 weeks ago237 Comments Report this Story
An old video displaying Kennedy's position on the separation of chusch and state.
Read Full Story at youtube.com
Join the Discussion 
+ Add Comment
Comments So Far: 237
-
0%
jovial8 months, 3 weeks ago
We need a leader like this guy now. I see the qualities that Kennedy had in none of the candidates. No leader has arisen from the field of candidates. Republican or Democrat. We are forced to pick the best out of a lot of losers. He distanced himself nicely from Religion. The complete opposite of what I see going on today in America. I'll provide you one additional link. This was a campaign commercial in 1960 where Kennedy was directly questioned about religion from a lady in the crowd.
http://livingroomcandidate.movingimage.us/elect...
Reply-
0%
jovial8 months, 3 weeks ago
If the link won't load for you it's the 6th from the top on the Kennedy side on the small index on the right of the page. This livingroom candidate website is great to see what commercials were used in prior campaigns back to 1952!
If you have a chance browse the other videos on the site.
Reply-
0%
Locky128 months, 3 weeks ago
Don't forget, it was a different time.
In school you could learn about the Jewish and Christian faith. That includes prayer.
Not anymore.
Now there's a movement to take "under God" out of the Pledge of Allegiance.
In JFK's time. It was understood as Freedom of Religion.
Today too many people wish it read: Freedom From Religion and are trying to make the courts recognize it that way.
Reply
-
-
-
0%
DarkWizard8 months, 3 weeks ago
Good post jovial.
Obviously, a lot has changed since Kennedy made that speech. Unfortunately, I would say for the worse.
Reply -
0%
jordan118 months, 3 weeks ago
His words should be played to every school child. Matter of fact, the democratic candidates should be playing it to the American people who seem to have forgotten who we are.
I remember the day he was shot like it was yesterday. I wrapped up my baby & drove to a Catholic church where dozens of others were in line to light a candle for him. People were driving and crying, or just sitting in their cars on the side of road, crying. It was like the world stopped. Country's around the world flew their flags at half-staff, & television/radio played nothing but news of him around the world. It really did break America's heart to lose him.
Reply-
0%
BoxMonkey8 months, 3 weeks ago
Yeah , It's nice that Joe Kennedy's rum running money bought John that Presidency . Joe Kennedy would go to the ends of the world to make sure John got in , since the first choice got killed in WWII . Kennedy was good in some ways and just as bad as the rest in others . Last time I checked , he was still a human being .
Reply
-
-
0%
Spadecaller8 months, 3 weeks ago
Excellent post jovial. I remember those days; I had listened to just about all of JFK's speeches at home and in school. Those were times when the nation still respected the "absolute" separation of church and state without even daring to pander for the votes of one religion or one denomoinaton or another.
Those were also the times just after McCarthy had exploited the Red Scare to scapegoat communists, Jews, and homosexuals; a time when Richard Nixon, the young lawyer, who had defended McCarthy and then built a career by destroying good people's reputations and careers.
Today we have the worst of both those outcomes. An administration worse than Nixon's, that exploits the war on terrorism for greed, exploits religion to manipulate the masses; all to serve their corporate masters, who have destroyed our constitutional government.
Remnants of a dream forgotten...
Reply-
0%
Radiofreeeuropa8 months, 3 weeks ago
It is the American people who must hold the shame for allowing themselves to be led down the primrose path to a fascist state. They have allowed what previous generations would not.
They have elected to to elevate the least intelligent and self serving among us to leadership.They have abandoned and perverted the principals upon which their nation was founded.
Reply-
0%
cushi8 months, 3 weeks ago
I believe a lot of it is directly attributable to the dumbing down of America, and our high tolerance for drugs, illicit sex and alcohol. Too many of our young people of voting age are coked out, liquored up or dying from sexually transmitted diseases. They are not in the least bit concerned about exercising the precious right to vote. I think Dr. Ruth Westheimer did tremendous damage to our collective psyche with her mantra: If it feels good, do it! Yes, it was funny to see that petite little grandma impersonator making such a statement, but the impact of those words has been negative, for the most part. It is a very sad but true commentary on our society in general.
It's one thing to be able to forgive someone's weaknesses and faults, but quite another to enable them to continue in them, whatever they may be.
Reply
-
0%
simonsez8 months, 3 weeks ago
What has changed?
Abortion wasn't legal at that time, there was no great pressure to remove God from schools (one nation, under God, prayer), remove God from the currency, remove God from public buildings and public speech. We accepted back then that we were basically a Christian nation, but it wasn't a daily confrontation.
Much of the discontent has been brought on by those who intend to force us to be non-religious. As a nation, we are not.
Reply-
0%
jovial8 months, 3 weeks ago
In 1960 abortion was illegal in every state in the union. In forty-five states an exception was made if the mother's life were in danger from the preg-nancy. For the rich there was a way out: a women could go to certain doctors at certain hospitals and claim she would kill herself if forced to carry the pregnancy. Thus her life was in danger, and an abortion was permitted. Other women were having abortions illegally. Some were performed by surgeons in sterile environments for a large fee, but most were done by amateurs using dangerous methods. To a non-religious person it would seem that religious people are trying to force their beliefs on them.
Reply -
lovermanComment removed: User banned.11 Replies
-
0%
hyperbola8 months, 3 weeks ago
Well Simon, with that you simply show us that you are ignorant and pushing propaganda that was never true. The pledge of allegiance only became widespread in the US during WWII as our copying of the pledges of the Hitler Youth Corps and the Young Soviets. "One nation under god" was only inserted in 1952. For that matter "in god we trust" only reached all our coins in 1938, for much the same sorts of reasons.
Far from what you claim, it was the introduction of these kinds of totalitarian devices, which our democracy did without for almost 200 years, that have caused the rebellion against imperialistic theocracy in the US.
Reply -
0%
GHOSTWHOWALKS8 months, 3 weeks ago
What has changed?
Everything. A steady stream of the fanatics and their attempt to bully all of us who may, or may not believe in their interpretation of the bible. Example: God says, "women will be subservient to their husbands; you have to believe what I say without exception, or comment. God doesn't belong on money, or in schools; government offices, etc. It is their attempt to remove God from everything.
How can anyone believe that God-in one form or another-should be removed from a Nation that was part and parcel of what we (this Nation) was formed on. There should be a separation of church and government.
I believe in God but refuse to force my believe on anyone who doesn't.
Reply
-
0%
wtagg8 months, 3 weeks ago
A big part of the problem is pandering and lobbying in general.
I should have the freedom to believe as I choose without government interference. It is not the government's job.
It certainly isn't a conservative point of view either. A true conservative wants no governmental interference in his or her religious belief system or faith.
Reply
-
-
0%
traveler20008 months, 3 weeks ago
I'm afraid the whole American electoral system is totaly wrong and became actulay totaly non-democratic:
Now a days, the canddates are scrutanized for their personal life: married? divorced? Christian? atheist etc...
All things that concernes their PERSONAL life.
As long it is their personal life and they didn't do anything criminal, it is their live.
I do not care if they cheat on their wife, as long he doesn't beat her and as long his sexlife is between consenting adults and he doesn't abuse childeren.
I do not care if he believes in a God or is an atheist. As long he does not imposes he's views on me, eventough I do accepte we (incl him) are always a little influensed by our believes and backgrounds. As long it is only an influence.
..... cont....
Reply -
0%
traveler20008 months, 3 weeks ago
.... cont ...
I am interested in his social and economic program, as wel as his foreign policy. He should try to serve as much citizen as possible (majority) and at the same time respect as much as possible minorities or people of different oppinions (minority/oposition).
An other MAJOR problem is the cost of American elections. Only in the US is their so much money given to the candidates for their campaign. I am amazed how candidates are even proud of receiving the most campaign money. It seems "the more the better". How can you stay "objective" if you "own" so much money to "certain people, pressure-groups or compagnies"
Reply-
-
0%
traveler20008 months, 3 weeks ago
I wonder if ONE day, an honest, decent US president, gouvernment or House and Senate, will change that and/or at least put a DECENT cap on that.
Problem of course is that this may need a lot of courage, as he would probably be in danger of a complot.
There are so many "needed" in the US (and else where) and then to see all those millions onf dollars spend on a campaign. Money that could be better used for other things (and I do not mean for more weapons.....)
Reply
-
-
0%
dwemm8 months, 3 weeks ago
traveler, I agree.
I think another issue is that boring stuff like social, economic and foreign policy statements like Kennedy's here are not particularly salable to newspaper buyers or advertising execs.
Brittany and Lindsay and Monica and Linda sell papers, because they allow quick and easy attitude judgements to be made. People can easily confuse this with "morals" and think themselves superior.
The same thing with wearing religion like a badge on your sleeve. If the comedy team of Huckabee and Norris can get away with their current religious sales pitch, it'll sell more copies and go viral on the net, selling more for YouTube/Google. (And for Propeller as Netscape/AOL sells advertising for their very popular site here...)
The fact is that money controls both organized religion and politics at this moment in history. We'll be stuck with the shame.
Reply-
0%
traveler20008 months, 3 weeks ago
....fact is that money controls both organized religion and politics at this moment in history. ....
Indeed very truth, unfortunatly.
And it is also fact that for many people, including a lot of intelectuals and intelligent people, religion does give people a sens of life and a sens of belonging.
I might be wrong (correct me if I am), but I also wonder if the Americans are not somehow, I wouldn't say "brainwashed" but ignorant of the rest of the world. After all, most information they get from the rest from the world is from US orientated sources (good and/or bad). Even "foreign movies" are "remade" by American filmmakers with American actors. Most Americans have no idea of how the rest of the world realy is. How many of them do travel outside of the US? Most of them have only one or two weeks vacation. No time (for most) to go e.g. to Europe or another continent.
Reply
-
-
0%
KISA452a8 months, 3 weeks ago
Traveler2000, do you not think that a person's choices in private life reflect on his/her decision making ability? This person voluntarily promised to "have and to hold until death do us part". Then broke that promise. That seems to reflect on their trustworthiness, imo. If a Christian or Atheist, that tells me something about their general philosophy about life (nothing is 100% so I know they don't believe exactly what anyone else does). If a Catholic, it is reasonable to ask if they would take "orders" from the pope if requested to.
To ignore "private" life seems to ignore a VAST amount of information about a person's character which I, personally, think is important.
Of course, ignoring everything else is probably a mistake as well.
Reply-
0%
traveler20008 months, 3 weeks ago
....person's choices in private life reflect on his/her decision making....
Of course, everything one does is influenced by character, philosophy, past experiences, education and so on.
However, when it comes to PRIVATE life, it is (mostly)NOT relevant: If the person cheats or divorces from his spouse, does not mean that he will be a bad leader with good and honest ideas. As it is private, we don't know HOW it came to that. Or he/she might have done a honest mistake by taking this spouse. It happens. What is important is his/her ideas.
Are they logical, fair, for the common good (or only for a small group), are they realistic, affordable....
Has he/she experience in leadership, and has he prooven his quality before?
Those are the important questions.
........ cont ......
Reply -
0%
traveler20008 months, 3 weeks ago
..... cont...
I am raised catholic, but atheist by choice You probably guessed). I don't care if you, he, she are/is or not. As long your arguments are somehow logical. e.g. I don't mind (to much) the Islam, but do not impose your views, based on "old books", on me: do not impose your "sharia laws" rather than laws voted after open debate and respect for all (logical) views.
But, in a way, yes we are all influensed by a lot of things in our personal history. As long however that we are open to other ideas and influences.
Reply
-
-
-
0%
Jaydee408 months, 3 weeks ago
It was a time when many good people wanted a better world, look how far we've come from that.
Reply-
0%
simonsez8 months, 3 weeks ago
Good people still want a better world, however your concept of a better world may differ from mine.
Reply-
0%
jovial8 months, 3 weeks ago
Simon that's a big problem. You are right. When I see us on one hand torturing people and claiming moral superiority, I don't see a better world. When I see corruption in government that serves the elite and punishes the rest, I don't see a better world. When I see the killing of thousands of people called collateral damage, I don't see a better world. When I see injustice, rape, murder accepted by governments in passing, i don't see a better world. When I see wars without end, and the hopes and dreams of whole generations destroyed, I don't see a better world. When i see corporate interests with a lack of repect for the environment that we live in, I don't see a better world. When I see religions, getting involved in politics, I don't see a better world. The reason religion shouldn't be invlved in politics, is because politics are corrupt. Religions are easily tainted.
Reply
-
